# I understand and know advantage of using a longer handles

Posted by MIKE (93VE) on September 08, 2002 at 10:44:51:

In Reply to: answers.... posted by Matt on September 08, 2002 at 00:41:35:

There has been many times when I've used a cheater pipe for more leverage, but that's related to a lever type action not a clamping type like the calipers and pads. I don't see how putting a caliper out futher will increase the pounds per square inch force needed to stop a rotating mass, since we're dealing with a clamping force instead of a lever/pivot type force. As you're aware there are many different factors that can effect the force applied to the rotors. Everything from the dia. of the master cylinder, caliper and wheel cylinder pistons, also the length of the brake pedal (which is a lever) If the caliper/pads remains the same the force applied will also remain the same. Isn't torque a twisting force, I just don't see how torque is a factor in our braking system. When diagnosing severe brake problem most service manuals will ask you to install a pressure gauge at the caliper to see what pressure you're getting, times that by the square area of the pads and you get your psi. Again I just don't see how torque (twisting) is a factor in our braking system

Replys:

- As Mentat said, it doesn't change the pressure exerted on the rotor... The same pressure is applied farther from the center point to provide more torque to stop the car. nm Matt (93SE) 13:26:53 9/08/2002 (0)
- I'm well out of my knowledge here but I think the key is putting the point of application of the force (the caliper) further from the actual center of rotation would increase leverage? I'm picturing a line drawn from the hub to the caliper here... and the longer that line, the more leverage? am I on the right track here? mentat (93se 5spd) 12:24:24 9/08/2002 (9)
  - Yes, another example would be.. Maximamike (92 SE) 12:37:12 9/08/2002 (8)
    - Dont get we wrong I totally understand the longer handle for more leverage, but MIKE (93VE) 14:00:07 9/08/2002 (5)
      - Uhhhh, the axle? Since that's where it's turning around, and attached to the moving part of the car. hmmmm. nm Matt (93SE) 14:58:42 9/08/2002 (4)
        - Interesting MIKE (93VE) 17:10:56 9/08/2002 (3)
          - I would say you're correct as far "clamping force", but thats only part of the "Stopping Force" equation.... mentat (93se 5spd) 18:20:37 9/08/2002 (2)
            - Thank-you MIKE (93VE) 20:26:34 9/08/2002 (1)
              - Yup, you're getting it... mentat (93se 5spd) 10:56:21 9/09/2002 (0)
    - OT mike any update on your friend's rims... email me n/m mentat (93se 5spd) 12:44:27 9/08/2002 (1)
      - Oh shit, sorry bout that. I'll send ya an email when I get back to school tomorrow.. Maximamike (92 SE) 13:10:18 9/08/2002 (0)

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: There has been many times when I've used a cheater pipe for more leverage, but that's related to a lever type action not a clamping type like the calipers and pads. I don't see how putting a caliper out futher will increase the pounds per square inch force needed to stop a rotating mass, since we're dealing with a clamping force instead of a lever/pivot type force. As you're aware there are many different factors that can effect the force applied to the rotors. Everything from the dia. of the master cylinder, caliper and wheel cylinder pistons, also the length of the brake pedal (which is a lever) If the caliper/pads remains the same the force applied will also remain the same. Isn't torque a twisting force, I just don't see how torque is a factor in our braking system. When diagnosing severe brake problem most service manuals will ask you to install a pressure gauge at the caliper to see what pressure you're getting, times that by the square area of the pads and you get your psi. Again I just don't see how torque (twisting) is a factor in our braking system